Saved By The Bell...

[TGJB]

...and not a moment too soon.

So, Friedman came along and saved Alydar/Janis/Tom/Hell-Hath-No-Fury from having to do what he agreed to do, which was to discuss the issues (multiple gross errors) in Ragozin\'s Derby and Breeder\'s Cup figures, on Ragozin\'s board.

Rather than tell Friedman that if they had done nothing wrong they had nothing to fear, Tom apologized to him (!!), and offered to continue the conversation with me via private e-mail. Where no one would know.

Uh, no thanks.

[beyerguy]

Sincere question, not trying to be a smart@$$...is the purpose of all these threads about the Rags board to try and lure their customers away?

Just curious, and there is certainly nothing wrong with that.  They don\'t make for very good reading for those of us who don\'t care about Rags numbers, that is all.

[TGJB]

Yeah, that\'s pretty much it, and I know they don\'t make for fun reading. Good news is, they usually take place only around the Triple Crown and Breeders Cup, and only sporadically the rest of the year.

The problem for me is in finding examples that are neither open to interpretation, nor involve theoretical issues that go over heads-- I\'ve tried that, and some get it, but some don\'t, since most haven\'t made figures. That means finding examples in major races, that are easy to see if they are pointed out, and relatively easy to understand. And again, the problem is not the errors (well, it is a problem if it\'s systemic, which it obviously is if they can\'t get the Derby and BC right), but more importantly, that they deny the errors, won\'t discuss them, and most importantly won\'t fix them when they are pointed out. How much credibility can the rest of their work have?

So yeah, that\'s why I do it. And that\'s why I went to Vegas for the Expo-- I was told it was going to be a debate.

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

Beyerguy,

With all due respect, how can it not be important?  The only way it can\'t be important is if you assume that the figures are icons that are pure and perfect in and of themselves. It doesn\'t work that way. When you call a 16=1 horse to be competitive in a race, you have to know if he is two, three or four points off the best efforts of the others and whether he\'s just paired up. Are you immersed enough in an activity to the point of understanding it  so thoroughly you shake your head incredulously at the nonsense perpetrated by others in that field? I\'m not talking figures, take your pick of topics. Was Bush ignorant or lying and why is he finally coming clean on Iraq? Dubya doesn\'t have to sell sheets though. At least not any longer.



Post Edited (12-21-04 17:37)

[TGJB]

CTC-- I don\'t think Beyerguy was saying it wasn\'t important, just that he didn\'t pay much attention to Ragozin and so found the conversation boring and/or annoying.

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

No, he didn\'t say \"its not important\" and I enjoy Beyerguy\'s posts. But to my mind, the debate is educational and it is important to anyone that uses figures as their primary tool.

[Frank]

Chuckles_the_Asskissin\'Clown2,

Why is it important? I use figures as my primary tool and I don\'t give a flying f.. about how they\'re made, who makes them or who THINKS who made a mistake. It doesn\'t affect my bottom line an iota one way or the other.

Frank

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

frank, thats cuz youre a retard

freakin idiot raggie



Post Edited (12-21-04 18:41)

[TGJB]

Frank-- I don\'t want this to get out of hand, and I\'m not looking to get into another brawl right now since I just ended one (and the other guy knows who won). But I have to ask you, how come you haven\'t called the guys on the other board asskissers? I would say the fawning posts there outnumber ours oh, maybe 10-1 or so.  

In the end, you do care about how they are made, since it DOES affect your results-- you just don\'t know it.

And finally, it\'s not about \"thinking\" someone made a mistake (and didn\'t correct it when it was pointed out)-- not if you can prove it. And I did.

[Frank]

Jerry,

It\'s not going to get out of hand. I took a shot at the clown because his bullcrap quotient is off the chart and I didn\'t like him in his last go round as the racist clown either.

His posts alone make your 10-1 ratio impossible. The guy never shuts his piehole.

In the end, I really don\'t care because it DOESN\'T affect my results. I think for every mistake they make you make one and vice-versa. You guys are just widget makers. Us users determine who wins and who loses by how good we are at using your widgets.

Finally, I don\'t think you proved anything. You presented your opinion and they chose not to respond. Not because they were caught without an answer but because that is their strategic response to your strategy.

And, AK_clown, I currently use TG.

Frank

[TGJB]

Frank-- I do agree that you guys have a little to do with whether you succeed or not-- it\'s not ALL me.

The proof I\'m talking about can be found in the charts and replays of the Derby and BC Sprint, whether they choose to respond or not-- evidence is evidence unless it is refuted. It is definitely NOT mistake for mistake with the widgets, but you have no way of knowing that-- not if you don\'t care enough to look.

CTC did some stuff that got him barred first go round, but when he came back he had cleaned up his act. Others who misbehaved here, one way or another, refused to modify their behavior. So he gets to come back, and they don\'t. Regardless, you want to dispute 10-1, fine. But it\'s WAY more, and no one seems to think that\'s a problem.

[Frank]

Jerry,

I think it\'s fair that AK_clown gets to come back. After all it\'s your board, your rules. But you are what you are and he is still the racist he used to be. But I do believe in second chances. After all, I fired you for misbehaviour once upon a time and now look, I\'m back.

You are right. I don\'t care to look. Time is a valuable and limited commodity. I prefer to spend mine studying your good, but far from perfect figures and try to scope out winners.

When are you coming out with a sales supplement. Alan told me you might have something two years ago.

Frank

[TGJB]

We were looking at doing a sales supplement with Equine Commerce, but they couldn\'t make it. Send me an e-mail about what you\'re looking for, we\'ll see if there\'s something we can do.

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

Frank,

You wouldn\'t understand this game if you were a horse, being a horse\'s ass makes it impossible.

Besides, I wasn\'t barred. It was a self imposed exile. I merely objected to providing my personal email. But, if cretins insist upon stirring old mud, they are easy enough to put in their place.

lol

Retard

CtC



Post Edited (12-21-04 23:14)

[beyerguy]

CtC,

I wasn\'t saying it wasn\'t important.  Its just that I\'m already convinced the Rags guys make a lot of errors.

I don\'t have to read the posts though, so my fault there.  And I\'m certainly not going over to the Rags board just to understand these threads.

As far as Rags, I learned all I needed to know about them with Clock Stopper.  First, they are in error to say he broke poorly.  He did not, period.  Second, even if he did, to adjust his figure for a slow break is craziness.  I think they got the ground wrong then tried to come up with a plausible excuse, but this made them look even worse.

Frank,

I\'d like you point out a few of the errors JB has made since you say you think both makes errors.  I\'ve seen many pointed out about Rags (and proven), and none about TG figs.  And I don\'t just mean on this board, maybe from the other?