Another batch of Jerry Cooneys goes down

[smalltimer]

Neither Rachel or QR have ever won a race at 10f, or did I miss something?  
Two of the best races of Z\'s career were on the dirt at OP.  
If she gets beat, its very unlikely to be either Rachel or QR.
Enough

[TGJB]

I have to believe there will be places where you can make that head to head prop bet if they meet in the BC.

[richiebee]

If RA runs in the \"Ladies\", I hope they would move the race to Saturday.

Leamas -- Team Zen much more concerned with HOY than undefeated career. If she
can be assured of HOY without running in any BC race, then you might have a point.
I personally think they are looking to run the table, and she will only miss the
Classic if dinged up.

Query: If the voting was conducted today, who would be 2010 HOY?

Jimbo -- I am expecting a \"lifetime best\" rant from you (and you have had some
good ones) if Zenyatta\'s final prep is in a race named for her.

[MonmouthGuy]

smalltimer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>  If she\'s 19-19 heading into the
> classic, why would they not take on all comers at
> 10 furlongs especially since she\'s already proven
> the distance won\'t beat her, only a faster 10
> furlong horse, of which, none currently exist.
>


****Opinion, not fact. QR has run faster at 10F than Z.

I\'d like to ask you an honest question.

Is your view that she can run \"as fast as she wants\" in any race?  (e.g.  If she had run in the Whitney she would have run the negative 3 necessary to beat Blame and QR instead of the 3 she needed to beat Rinverness?)

[P-Dub]

MonmouthGuy Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> smalltimer Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> >  If she\'s 19-19 heading into the
> > classic, why would they not take on all comers
> at
> > 10 furlongs especially since she\'s already
> proven
> > the distance won\'t beat her, only a faster 10
> > furlong horse, of which, none currently exist.
> >
>
>
> ****Opinion, not fact. QR has run faster at 10F
> than Z.
>
> I\'d like to ask you an honest question.
>
> Is your view that she can run \"as fast as she
> wants\" in any race?  (e.g.  If she had run in the
> Whitney she would have run the negative 3
> necessary to beat Blame and QR instead of the 3
> she needed to beat Rinverness?)


Why do some of you insist on comparing dirt figures with synthetic figures??  Your example is ridiculous.

[TGJB]

Why do you insist upon responding to every single comment about Smith or Zenyatta?

Zenyatta has run on dirt twice. Some horses improve on dirt, some do not, she has the same top on both.

[P-Dub]

TGJB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Why do you insist upon responding to every single
> comment about Smith or Zenyatta?
>
> Zenyatta has run on dirt twice. Some horses
> improve on dirt, some do not, she has the same top
> on both.

I don\'t respond to every single comment. Hyperbole.

Tell me JB, how many different threads have been on your board talking about the same thing over and over?? Specifically, the whole Zenyatta thing and her numbers, or the whole dirt vs synthetic number, or the quality of her competition, or that she races mainly in California?

You can probably start at around 50 and go from there.

Since you mentioned Mike Smith, how many posts have there been about \"Wide Mike Smith\"??  When was the last time you told somebody..\"Why do you insist on responding to every Mike Smith reference with another wide ride comment\"??

BTW, I was responding to someone comparing a dirt race at Saratoga, with a Polycrap race at Del Mar with ridiculously slow fractions.

[Leamas57]

richiebee Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If RA runs in the \"Ladies\", I hope they would move
> the race to Saturday.
>
> Leamas -- Team Zen much more concerned with HOY
> than undefeated career. If she
> can be assured of HOY without running in any BC
> race, then you might have a point.
> I personally think they are looking to run the
> table, and she will only miss the
> Classic if dinged up.
>
> Query: If the voting was conducted today, who
> would be 2010 HOY?
>
> Jimbo -- I am expecting a \"lifetime best\" rant
> from you (and you have had some
> good ones) if Zenyatta\'s final prep is in a race
> named for her.


Probably LAL would be HOY. I disagree that HOY trumps record, btw: lot\'s of HOYs, very few undefeated lifetime runners with many graded stakes (despite the asterix for synth.

Leamas

--Leamas

[smalltimer]

I don\'t think I\'ve ever said she can run \"as fast as she wants.\"  I may have said she has run as fast as she has had to in order to win. Pretty hard to dispute that comment.  That\'s been the case 18 times in a row.  She can be beaten.    
The idea that QR ran a faster 10 furlongs is bogus, he was looking at Summer Bird\'s rear end at the finish line. QR hasn\'t proven he can win a 10f race, and Zenyatta has.  
I\'m not concerned with big negative TG numbers when it comes to Z.  If that were the case you could just bet the best negative number and win every single time.  On paper, Blame couldn\'t beat QR last Saturday based on numbers, Blame was inferior on paper and in TG numbers, but we all know who won the race.  So, lower TG numbers don\'t guaranteed victories, they only offer the excuse the horse lost at \"less than his/her best.\"    
QR\'s a really nice horse, he may be experiencing some minor foot problems, or he may have just been a little flat when he got beat, maybe he just didn\'t feel like running, who knows?.  So far, Zenyatta has managed to win 18 times and I haven\'t had to make one single excuse for her yet.  If she gets beat I\'m sure I\'ll start out with a very legitimate excuse in that she is now a 6 year old mare.    
There\'s always that fascination with the big negative numbers. Put them all in the gate at Churchill and may the best horse win.  Not the fastest horse, the best horse that day.  I\'ll take the horse that constantly overcomes adversity in the race and still runs like a champion. What TG number do you assess based on a will to win?  Zenyatta is a negative 10 in that area.  
A small problem on this board are the Rachel and QR lovers.  Sorry, they\'ve both been beaten this year....Say it out loud:  THEY\'VE BOTH BEEN BEATEN THIS YEAR.  
Had Rachel returned this year as great as last year, or if QR was actually good enough to win every race in rousing fashion, this board would be filled with guys slobbering all over their accomplishments.  I hope these 3 and Blame all remain healthy enough to test each other in November.  3 great horses are gonna lose in that horse race.  The last 1/8th of that race could be spectacular.    
I\'m not in love with Zenyatta or the type of campaign she\'s been conducting the last 2 years, but its hard to knock the results. But, I won\'t deny I\'m a very big fan of her, she overcomes whatever obstacles are in her way and she keeps finding a way to get the job done.  She\'s had sub-par outs but still gets the job done, she\'s conceded a lot of weight and won.    
If Zenyatta evers gets in a horse race and runs her typical 0 or -1, and Rachel or QR (or somebody) runs a huge negative number like a -3, to -7 then she\'s probably gonna get her doors blown off and that will end the discussion.  
Hope I answered your honest question honestly.
Have a good one

[TGJB]

PDub-- there\'s been a lot of talk about it, what\'s your point? Believe it or not, it doesn\'t go that all the people on the other side get to post their opinions, and you get equal time with all of them combined. You disagree, you\'re on the record, over and over. Enough unless there\'s a specific new point to answer.

[MonmouthGuy]

Thank you for your honest response.

Blame had a great pattern and was coming off a strong closing negative 2 in the Foster. I thought he would need a little extra distance to get to QR and was hoping to get him at a price at 10F in the fall, which will not happen now.

Blame hasn\'t been beaten this year and he has been facing open competition at the highest levels in the older male handicap division.  You may want to repeat that sentence out loud.