BC CLASSIC

[slewzapper]

Whether one agrees with the reasoning behind the steward\'s decision or not, yesterday\'s Classic start and first furlong resembled the beginning to the feature race at CD on the first Saturday in May, in just about every year. Don\'t recall much steward intervention in that situation over the years, nor much righteous indignation from handicappers over the lack of same.  

Interestingly, the back view didn\'t look as outrageous as the head on - Bayern had partially cleared SB and came over, Moreno came out a bit and was ahead of SB as well. VE Day walked out. No horse appeared to have lost their action.

[Boscar Obarra]

If they changed things, the first time one of your horses got put last after veering in at the start, you\'d wish for the \'good old days\'

[jerry]

Disqualification is meant to act as a preventative just as any punishment behind a law. It\'s meant to discourage specific behavior.

[jerry]

No horse appeared to have lost their action? You need to watch it again.

[Boscar Obarra]

Highly doubtful the jockey did that deliberately, as the other riders would make sure he never walked again if they thought so.

 As for discouraging 1200 lb horses from veering in at the start, good luck to you.

[Bet Twice]

Yes, I\'m sure the horse would have learned his lesson had he been disqualified.

[jerry]

I have no doubt the initial contact was the horses idea. Even so, while there was no malicious intent, it\'s still a foul. Murder 1 vs. manslaughter. The guys still dead and somebody\'s got to pay.

[jerry]

So every time a horse causes interference by lugging in it\'s OK? I don\'t think you\'ll say yes.

[fjmb]

C\'mon Wrongly - Horses never come down for interference at the start.

[TMW]

fjmb Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> C\'mon Wrongly - Horses never come down for
> interference at the start.

http://espn.go.com/horse-racing/story/_/id/11806565/bayern-disqualified

I don\'t know you and therefore don\'t know if your comment is tongue in cheek but those who for some reason agree with the stewards or the Baffert camp -- you are in the minority opinion. The ESPN link sums up my feelings.

For instance, what if the roles were reversed and Moreno wiped out Bayern? Bayern would have probably lost by double digit lengths too (probably not 40+ though). He probably would have been disqualified as well since the trainer is not local.

With pace pressure Bayern is a common animal. Baffert knows that and he will retire him eventually for exactly the same reason he retired Game On Dude. Neither could pass a horse.

[bellsbendboy]

\"Dude\" was retired because BB thought he had the Classic winner in his barn, although calling Bayern a \"common sort\" may indicate a bit of bias on your part.  bbb

[TMW]

bellsbendboy Wrote:
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> \"Dude\" was retired because BB thought he had the
> Classic winner in his barn, although calling
> Bayern a \"common sort\" may indicate a bit of bias
> on your part.  bbb

\"He ran a great race in the Pacific Classic, but it\'s gotten to the point where there is always going to be some horse who is going to be sacrificed by running with him and forcing him into ridiculous fractions, as was the case at Del Mar,\" Baffert said. \"It\'s starting to wear on him a little bit to the point where it\'s not fun for him anymore. We always felt if he couldn\'t compete at the grade I level and wasn\'t enjoying what he was doing, it would be time to retire him.\"
-Bob Baffert on Game On Dude\'s retirement.

This is why he was retired and not because of any other reason. And, Baffert does not own the horses. You are saying a trainer had the authority to retire someone\'s horse (a very successful multiple Grade 1 winner) to accommodate another horse that he trains and does not own? No.

What I said was they are similar because they have never shown any ability to pass another horse. This comment is relevant to the BC race because the only other early pace horse (Moreno) was completely violated and taken out of the race. If Moreno got the early lead I don\'t think Bayern could pass him based on many previous races. That is why Garcia was hell-bent to get the lead at any cost. It is also relevant because that is why Game On Dude was retired (according to Baffert).

Both horses are superbly talented -- but they must have things their own way because they cannot pass other horses -- opinion based only on their race performances and no bias toward Baffert or his horses.

[Rich Curtis]

\" If Moreno got the early lead I don\'t think Bayern could pass him based on many previous races.\"

What are the names of these \"many previous races\" that show that Bayern could not have passed Moreno?

[TMW]

Rich Curtis Wrote:
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> \" If Moreno got the early lead I don\'t think
> Bayern could pass him based on many previous
> races.\"
>
> What are the names of these \"many previous races\"
> that show that Bayern could not have passed
> Moreno?

Arkansas Derby -- Race Calls -- 1, 1, 1, 2, 3
Preakness -- 8, 7, 7, 7, 9
Travers -- 1, 1, 3, 10, 10

All other races -- 7 of 10 were virtually wire-to-wire. Twice he briefly dueled for the first race call (2nd by a head) and won but he didn\'t pass a horse and was not running against anything with early speed like Moreno ($1.8 million won including a Grade 1 and multiple other Graded stakes races).

Coincidences do occur in life and maybe it is a coincidence that the same trainer (Baffert) trained a horse that happened to impede with the same horse (Shared Belief) in back-to-back races that were both Grade 1 races at the same track (Santa Anita). I don\'t happen to buy it. My last words on this unfortunate subject.

[Rich Curtis]

So you look at wire-to-wire victories as evidence that the horse could not have won from second place? That seems a bit stringent. I look at them only as proof that the horse can win on the lead.

And you think that Preakness debacle, in which he was 8th early, suggests he can\'t win from 2nd?

And those two races in which he was outsprinted by a head to the first call? He won both of them.

Hell, technically, Bayern is undefeated when he is in 2nd place at the first call.

Bayern can\'t pass a horse? I think you are outsprinting your evidence here.