Pletcher....keeneland

[Fairmount1]

Zero facts???  Your kidding right?

The guy has had Grade I horses fall over dead in his care. Fact.  See Left Bank, Warners, Etc.

The guy has had multiple horses retired or get cancer because of a liver issue when these horses are young, talented athletes.  FACT.  See Uncle Mo, Devil May Care.  What does your liver do again?

The guy won at a 40% clip at Gulfstream in 2011-2012 winter meet.  At Churchill 2012, spring and fall he won ZERO races.  FACT.

This doesn\'t seem to bother you at all?  Why do you love him so much?

When he took a shot at Shug/Phipps/Janney over Orb and the lasix issue you were thrilled, pointing it out twice on the board to make sure people saw it.  Why?  Why is it that you relish in his success AND his potshots at competitors that actually have a well bred horse that can run his Violence into injury?

[miff]

Hmmm, you\'re tough.For me, all the conspiracy idiots and Kool aid drinkers.You are saying that TAP is using illegal PEDS.

YES or NO ?

[TGJB]

I\'m saying Allday has admitted using EPO while training for Pletcher and he\'s still training for Pletcher. I\'m saying based on what I can see over a very large sampling of data Pletcher is doing something to move horses up, not necessarily EPO.

You were confused about what I was saying before this?

[miff]

No, I see 99% of Pletchers figs,and don\'t see many move ups.Actually see them they usually run big early, flat line or go bad after a few starts.

He rarely gets horses from others, so don\'t know what move ups you speak of.His young horses that go forward are all move ups? None are just developing? Millions in stock and none with ability?

The whole barn is built around illegal stuff?

P.S if he gets an occasional one from elsewhere,it\'s not a bum,he don\'t take that kind.

[TGJB]

You\'re right, he can\'t move up horses that are already moved up. You win.

[Fairmount1]

I\'d Love to see Caixa Electronica\'s sheet or the recent horse he took over from Bob Dunham I believe.  There are others he has gotten from other trainers.

[TGJB]

Now that you mention it-- he had no negative numbers through March of his 6yo year when Pletcher claimed him. Since then he has run 9 of them, including 3 neg 2 1/2s and a neg 4 at the end of his 7yo campaign.

Now Miff will explain how that in fact is an indication of the opposite of what you think.

Like I have said before, it\'s tougher to tell with guys who have them from the beginning of their career. But once in a while...

[miff]

Fair,

I\'d prefer the Green Monkeys sheet.

[miff]

Since you know the answer, what does he do? Must be illegal stuff that Maylin can\'t find as all races are in NY.

[TGJB]

Leaving Pletcher out of this, I have mentioned several times here that EPO can\'t be caught with standard testing if it\'s given at 4 and 14 days from a race.
They need OOC testing, which they are not doing, contrary to what you heard. You want to keep playing this?

[miff]

We might be told there isn\'t enough money to do it all the time. If/when I can find out what/how NY tests for EPO in or OOC(as you suggest) I\'ll post it. Have serious doubt that I am going to inform the head of all testing in NY for years about something he\'s unaware of.

[Fairmount1]

I\'ve thought about him (Green Monkey).  And I\'ve thought about Arch Warrior too.  

I\'m not saying I have answers.  But you cannot get every horse to win every race.  Only Patrick Byrne was able to do that for a certain stretch one time.  Remind me who his vet was.

I agree he has well bred, expensive stock.  But so did Godolphin/Darley.  So do the Phipps/Janney.  So do others in the game.  He is winning these preps like they are just so easy every year.  Huge 14 horse fields.  He is making a mockery of the game on its most important stage but then absolutely falters at CD??  Its all very strange.  Doesn\'t this bother you??.

More Than Ready should have been our first clue.  We all were told he was as good as Secretariat during his 2yo season....then what?  Then I saw a long list of these horses like Balto Star\'s Ark Derby, Keyed Entry, Gemologist, Shaniko, Dunkirk, Rags to Riches, Uncle Mo,--I\'ve made money on his huge priced triple crown prep races over the years, but that doesn\'t mean I think it is right ....the list, it goes on and on and on....and meanwhile Lukas hasn\'t had a positive medication test since 1999 the year he won the Derby with Charismatic.  But he can\'t win jack until last 6 months it seems.  Dallas Stewart can\'t hardly win a thing with all the expensive ones he had.  Zito pops a decent one now and then but he gets expensive horseflesh.

Then Baffert has horses fall over dead.....the other great trainer of our time. Its all very odd.  

Its more than uncanny what Pletcher does.  Did you notice El Padrino was retired?  Why do you like him so much miff?  Just tell me that.

I just hope discussions like this shed light on this.  By the way, after Caixa what happened to Repole\'s claiming operation?  You think by chance that Pletcher thought it might create a negative perception like the discussion we are having?? hmmmm.....

[TGJB]

Correct. You are not. And even less likely he will tell you people are beating testing. Again, ask him if they can pick up EPO administered on that schedule. he might tell you that.

[miff]

Fair,

You getting into areas way over your head. You would not know Mike Repole if you tripped over him. Idiotic conspiracy theories about a billionaire fooling in the claiming game is really out there.

Do you think the large insures of expensive race horses just pay off at death without the most comprehensive post mortem exam possible?

Mike

[Fairmount1]

Yes, Miff, you are absolutely right.  Repole wants NO PART of \"fooling around\" as you say in the claiming game does he (what does \"dabble\" mean again in the article below)......from 2011.....as for over my head and Repole, why you so defensive about him???  You are starting to get personal Mike.  And you still won\'t say why you love Pletch SOOOO Much....

http://www.drf.com/news/repole-puts-pletcher-claiming-game

Let me highlight for you...I cut and pasted exactly what was written by Grening

"To take a horse for $40,000 and to win a stake with him first start back, tell me that's not impressive," Repole said. "Not only an impressive claim, it shows what [Pletcher] can do in 30 days with a horse."