Hansen

[dannyboy135]

TGJB Wrote:
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> Okay, just talked to a top Ky farm manager.
>
> 1-- The top offer from Ky for IHA was 3M (the
> Japanese paid much more). At 3M, he would have
> stood for 12.5-15k
>
> 2-- He says if Hansen retired today he would stand
> for 7.5-10k.


My source says the ky offer was 6 million and that he sold to the japs for twice that.
I do agree that Hansen at best would be a 10 k sire. Doesn\'t have the pedigree of trapp shot who is from same sire line and a much stronger bottom side
Bodemeister will be very well received but probably over oriced

[Silver Charm]

Hanson is going NEXT in the West Virginia Derby for $750K. No Haskell or Jim Dandy at Saratoga which seems to confirm the case that these guys are better off going for these restricted Big Purse 3YO races because the others are either: A) Not going to do much for his overall stud fee or B) Not winnable....or both!!

Iowa Derby for $250K
West Va Derby  $750K
Total Purses     $1.0M

But those two do not equal one Grade 1 $1.0M Travers and we know that. And considering the competition the hrse would face so do they.

Look I am not down on the horse and now seeing the Stud Economics this makes some sense what they are doing. These guys are having some fun. The partnership will stand the horse themselves and maybe have a decent book of ok mares. Nothing great but ok enough. And if the Kentucky Stud Gig doesnt work out there is always those emerging markets of Iowa and West Virginia to fall back on.    

As an athlete sometimes you want to step up and find out how good you are or can be. And try it more than once. Lets hope this athlete gets his chances before the Bus Tour comes to an end.....

[kekomi]

well, except for shack, union rags, and bode, and bode\'s actually questionable since he\'s only won 2 races and didn\'t race as a 2 year old, (seconds don\'t count for sh!t in breeding), none of these horse has or had a better record than hansen at the same point in their career.

shack\'s preakness is the most valuable 3 yo race for the shed. but i\'d be shocked f he goes above $15000

union rags value mostly comes from the fact that dixie union is dead and his wins at saratoga last year. his belemont isn\'t worth as much in the breeding shed first year out as hansen\'s juvenile win.

if i wanted a derby winner, i sure as heck wouldn\'t choose rags to get me there--at best he\'s a sport, since his full brother is a pure sprinter.

caleb\'s posse\'s only claim to fame this time last year was the ohio derby

jackson bend won\'t command anything in the shed, which is why he\'s still racing at 5--he was a disappointing 3 yo.

gemologist has only the wood--which has no value in the shed, unless you are an over-hyped esky. the juvenile trumps the wood in shed.

to honor and serve won\'t command anything either, he was a poor 3 year old, and is an inconsistent 4 year old.

paynter has nothing yet, and creative cause has nothing of value yet,

but to answer your question, i\'d love to breed to shack, but not becuase of his results, because he is a very rare double dr. fager (both top and bottom)--the good dr. is hard to come by.

personally, i could care less what you think about hansen\'s merits, he isn\'t my horse--but the very fact that he is the best male get of one the most sought after sires, ensures he\'ll start off at a healthy price.

shack, the best placed outside of hansen, union rags, and bode of the horse\'s on you list, is unlikely to top his sire\'s price of $12,500.

to honor and serve, caleb\'s posse, and jackson bend are unlikely to top $7500.

for the 3 year old\'s it\'s too soon--but the only ones out you list likely to match or top hansen are union rags and bode, but bode won\'t do it unless he starts winning some. breeders don\'t like horses that couldn\'t race at two..

[kekomi]

i\'m not questioning your veracity or your breeders knowledge but this seems low to me--unless the market is way worse than i think it is--a huge chunk of hansen\'s value comes from the fact that his sire demands $125,000 a pop, and is booked well in advance (2012 was fully booked before march).

hansen\'s half brother concord point gets $7500, and hansen\'s resume is far better than concord point\'s, i\'d be shocked if they don\'t stand hansen initially for $25,000--he\'ll attract many who want tapit but can\'t afford or get access to him

as for hansen\'s dam--before hansen, she wasn\'t worth anything--but she has a decent allowance horse and a multiple black type million in her first two foals--look at mining my own, to see how fast a blacktype winner improves a previously worthless mare.

but anyway, hasnen will get whatever he gets...but unless he gets injured his connections plan to run him next year, so it will be awhile before we find out who\'s guess was the best guess.

cheers

[kekomi]

sigh...the purse for any horse entering the west va derby with grade one win is $1 million dollars.

and hansen is pointed toward the travers--both maker and the owner have said this repeatedly and recently.

if you\'re going rail, at least get your facts right

[basket7777]

How is this thread helping us handicap and win?

[Rick B.]

basket7777 Wrote:
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> How is this thread helping us handicap and win?

Pick one:
1. Breeding discussions can help your handicapping down
   the line, or even today. Not everything in horse racing
   is \"figures\". We can\'t afford linear thinking in this
   game, IMO.

2. You asked the same question in the Frankel thread;
   do YOU have anything to contribute that will help us
   \"handicap and win\"? Step up...or ask for a refund of
   your forum membership fees.

If there is one thing that fascinates me about internet
forums, it\'s posters who complain about forum content but
never have anything significant to contribute.

[miff]

\"hansen\'s half brother concord point gets $7500, and hansen\'s resume is far better than concord point\'s, i\'d be shocked if they don\'t stand hansen initially for $25,000--he\'ll attract many who want tapit but can\'t afford or get access to him\"

Kek,

Unless Hansen does substantailly more at the top level, there is little chance he\'ll initially stand for $25k. I\'ll bet on it.


Mike

[P-Dub]

basket7777 Wrote:
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> How is this thread helping us handicap and win?

They have a link titled: \"Introduction, Samples and Tutorials\".

If you want to learn that badly, click the link and read up on all things handicapping until your cup runneth over. There\'s plenty.

There are many bright people around here that speak on a variety of subjects.  The vast majority of people enjoy the give and take.

If you don\'t like the other subjects, just ignore them.  When you find a subject discussing a race or horse, and there are several, then take from them what you want.

Lastly, have a Happy 4th of July. Its a day of celebration.

[Ill-bred]

Rick B. Wrote:
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>
> Breeders look at far more than just \"ma & pa\".
>
> In the first four dam side generations: Storm Cat,
> Private Account,
> Raise A Native, Temperence Hill.
>
> That\'s a wee bit more than \"zero\", don\'t you
> think?

Negative.

You are talking sires and broodmare sires, not female family.

Hansen is the only stakes horse of any type under his first four dams.

Genetically, that\'s a big concern.

Keep in mind Tapit has the ability to move cheap mares way way up.

[basket7777]

Wow

How poopie are you two.  I\'m here to read learn ect.  People arguing about if a horses sperm is worth 7500 or 25000 is no value at all but to those who think they know it all.

Reading both your post I am sure both of you think you do.  Your correct about the internet it brought you to us which is worst than getting taken down on a 15-1 shot.

Whats your real name?  Where do you sit most of the time?  I\'m at the meadowlands

it would be quite a pleasur to get to meet you. however i think you might think different afterwards.

[P-Dub]

basket7777 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Wow
>
> How poopie are you two.  I\'m here to read learn
> ect.  People arguing about if a horses sperm is
> worth 7500 or 25000 is no value at all but to
> those who think they know it all.
>
> Reading both your post I am sure both of you think
> you do.  Your correct about the internet it
> brought you to us which is worst than getting
> taken down on a 15-1 shot.

Never made a comment about a sire\'s worth.

>
> Whats your real name?

My name is known to everyone here.  Look it up under my preferences.

>  Where do you sit most of
> the time?  I\'m at the meadowlands

I live on the West Coast, Bay Area specifically.

Most of the time I sit on the couch, with an occasional trip to Santa Anita.


>
> it would be quite a pleasur to get to meet you.
> however i think you might think different
> afterwards.

I\'ve met several people from this community.  One was nice enough to pick me up at a condo on the Big Island and play a round of golf with him.  He took care of the green fees. I doubt he would have done that if he thought i was a prick.  Hung out with another at the Breeders\' Cup. Neither person seemed to be having a bad time in my company.

Wow, and you talk about others and the internet.  Here it is, the 4th of July with a great day of racing, and you want to take me behind the gym and beat me up. Ok.

Dude, pour yourself a cocktail and relax. Have a nice day.

[basket7777]

how will this help again?   please explain?  how is this a handicap tool for us ?

please explain this again  you just cyber babble to hear youreself and how good you are

explain again how this helps us with the sheets?

oh  so you know I was the one who got them to start doing charlestown. I was there with King T. Leatherberry  if you dont know one of the first and foremost users of the number to bet and claim.  

He taught me and i still want to learn.  Come as I said to the meadowlands sit near me and see what happens to the people around when I say i like a house. They might only be 3 or 4 a week but watch what happens.  It speaks volumes to both the sheets and there wallets.

cyberdick

[TGJB]

That\'s enough of the threats. You don\'t like his posts, don\'t read them.

[Silver Charm]

How about if we lined up those 10 horses I mentioned and ran them in a One Turn Mile at weight for age. Where would Hansen finish then? Maybe beat a couple?

So they say they are going to run in the travers. Well they said they going to Winter and race in Florida, (they didnt) run in the Wood (they didnt) run in the Preakness (they didnt) run in the Woody Stephens (they didnt) but have this Traveling Bus Tour thing thru the Midwest going.

While they are at it maybe they need to add a few more characters to the show. As Dr Hansen walks around in his Bermuda Shorts signing autographs maybe they should add a Juggler, Sword Swallower, Fire Breather, Man on Stilts, Belly Dancer, Pshycic, Palm Reader, then trot out the Great White Hope and let him roll around out there at .10 on the dollar. And after Hansen wins then Free Corn Dogs on the House. Pack\'em all back on the Bus and off to the next town.    

Doesnt exactly sound like Royal Ascot or Team Aga Kahn but its a Great Show and more of what racing needs.....And btw I am not down on the horse. The one time they really gave this athlete a real shot, in the BC Juvenile, he laid down on his white belly and gave it all he had down the stretch under a perfect ride by Ramon. So give him a couple more chances. He might surprise some people. Including me.....