Team Valor's Irwin on online chat Friday

[asfufh]

http://news.bloodhorse.com//viewstory.asp?id=37879

[asfufh]

\"Irwin: Somebody in a position of power has got to get mad enough to get the FBI involved in racing, because only this outfit has the tools and the motivation to attack the trainers and owners that use PEDs. I will say that I think fewer high-profile trainers seem to be cheating than 4 years ago.\"
Full transcript:
http://www.bloodhorse.com/talkinhorses/BI030907.asp

[richiebee]

Interesting read, a stand up guy (he\'s proven it by coming on board here and
fighting for what he believes in). The last question involved the whole \"Why did
you fire Ralph Nicks but not Todd Pletcher\" issue, and BI continues to stick to
his guns there.

I may have to take issue with involving the FBI in cleaning up horse racing. On
the one hand (and this coming from a person who drives by Ground Zero 5 days
per week) the FBI has much more pressing issues to contend with. On the other
hand, the FBI\'s overzealous abuse of the PATRIOT Act to gather intelligence
about US citizens shows that the FBI may be reverting to tactics utilized by a
former Bureau head who enjoyed a good day at the races almost as much as he
enjoyed wearing women\'s clothing.

We have discussed it here plenty -- the problem is not catching cheaters, but
rather in punishing these cheaters in a manner which will have a deterrent
effect on further transgressions.

[imallin]

Yeah, great read, Gotta thank Barry for being so candid about his feelings...we need more high profile owners to get involved and tell the industry how they feel.

As far as FBI goes, I\'d rather have them chasing terrorists than chasing trainers. If the punishment is a slap on the wrist, its not going to deter anyone.

Breaking a racing rule and breaking a US law are two different things....until doping a racehorse becomes an actual crime (as opposed to just breaking a racing rule) than we\'re going to still have people trying to take an edge.

I\'m not sure who mentioned this..may have been Jerry on his ATRAB interview that TCO2 levels that are UNDER 37 ML should be published...that way, we can see the guys who are consistently around the mid 30\'s. I\'d love to know that info as i\'m sure everyone else would.

[cubfan0316]

then why did we spend all this time getting the baseball cheaters?
we got everybody invovled. including the grand jury for christ sakes. end it all, you cheat once--- 1 year twice----->>> gone.

[cubfan0316]

and by the way, steriods only hurt the user in baseball, the public gets hurt in horseracing.

[imallin]

Steroids HELP baseball fans because the players can hit the ball farther...making the entertainment experience better.

But, thats probably a discussion for another day.

[miff]

\'\'Breaking a racing rule and breaking a US law are two different things....until doping a racehorse becomes an actual crime (as opposed to just breaking a racing rule) than we\'re going to still have people trying to take an edge.\'


Imallin,

It\'s been a federal crime to attempt to alter the outcome of a sporting event since the Blacksox Scandal. It\'s not sexy enough for the feds. The only reason they went after the small time Shakes Martin and cohorts was because they spoke of mafia and multi million dollar gambling, both of which were grossly exaggerated.

Harnes racing has been a known cesspool of race fixing et al and it is well known but nothing really ever happens too often.

Mike

[cubfan0316]

attendance never better. people love to see 105 mph fastballs and 500 ft. homers ,simple.

[cubfan0316]

race fixing is breaking the law guy.look it up

[imallin]

Doping racehorses and \'racefixing\' are two different things. A trainer putting a chemical into a horse is not viewed as an actual attempt to alter the event via racefix.

The feds, or whoever it may concern, views \'race fixing\' as when human beings (jockeys or trainers or owners) have actual discussions on altering the form of the horse in the running of the race. Any racefixes in the past were racefixes where people got caught on wiretaps and such.

Technically you all are correct to say that if a trainer intentionally administer\'s a chemical to alter the performance of his horse, it should be viewed as a racefix.

I just think some people\'s definition of \'racefixing\' involves verbal discussions between human beings and discussions of betting....where putting a chemical into a racehorse only involves the trainer.

[marcus]

baseball\'s antitrust exemption  makes that situation uniquely different  to horse racing , i agree with richibee and all those who view racing policing itself as the best case senario  + , imo - steriods  didn\'t help the game of baseball rather visa versa ...  i\'m going to check the barry irwin interview tomorrow but based on barry\'s postings that i\'ve seen here ,  he\'s alwys been sincere and candid -  he says what he means ...

[HP]

Have not posted in awhile.  Hi to all.  

This subject makes my blood boil.  I cannot understand why injecting a horse with a drug is not treated as simply \"animal abuse.\"  There are laws against abusing animals!  

If you starved your dog and your neighbor called the cops they would arrest you!  If you injected your dog with drugs they would arrest you too!  But if you drug a HORSE nobody can figure out what to do about it?  Every state and jurisdiction has laws on the books about abusing animals.  Injecting a horse with a drug to dull pain, enhance performance, whatever you want to call it, is endangering its welfare.  Not to sound like too much of a tree-hugger here, but really, I\'m baffled as to why these laws are not applied.  I can only assume no one wants to enter this \"new territory,\" but really, I don\'t get it.  My effin\' CAT has more rights and gets more protection than a racehorse?!?  What am I missing?  

The local authorities should be able to address it.  You can go to jail for possessing coke but if it turns up in a horse\'s bloodstream it is somehow impossible to figure out how to make criminal charges against the responsible parties?  It\'s up to the RACING AUTHORITIES?  Screw that.  The POLICE should arrest the trainer for animal abuse (I feel POSITIVE there are specific laws on this that could be interpeted broadly enough to apply -- let\'s hear from some of our lawyer posters like my pal David Patent -- if I\'m wrong let me have it, youse can\'t be any worse than my wife!).  

Take a few of these guys away in handcuffs and that will be the end of it.  Why can\'t the existing laws apply as opposed to reinventing the wheel with the FBI, et al.?

Good luck to all...  HP

[imallin]

HP, here\'s the problem.

Lets say that a trainer who gets a positive test gets arrested and charged. This would go to court.....the trainer would say, \"i didn\'t put any drugs in my horse, someone else must have done it when i wasn\'t looking\"

Can you really arrest and convict a trainer for drugging if you don\'t actually SEE him put drugs inside the horse?

If you had an arch enemy who was a trainer, all you would have to do is to pay off some groom to slip the horse an illegal drug in the middle of the night and wallah, instand jailtime for the guy you hate.

Who would want to be a trainer if they knew they\'d get a criminal record and possibly jail time if some chemical happened to show up in their horses system?

Imagine being a family man with a wife and kids and your horse eats some contaminated hay and the next thing you know the FBI is hauling you away in handcuffs in front of your children and neighbors?

Personally, i\'d never want to be a trainer if there was even a 1% chance i\'d be mistakenly hauled away by the FBI...i mean, who needs that?

[cubfan0316]

barry bonds says he didnt know what his trainer was giving him, hes innocent? somebody listed as trainer is liable, he has to make sure the horse is drug free. simple.