Late Odds Changes; Batch Wagering

[BitPlayer]

Some interesting comments from an Executive VP of the TRA reported in BloodHorse:

Some have discussed discontinuing wagering before the horses enter the gate, but Scherf said there is little sentiment for that.

\"We have lots of late money being wagered now. Why? Because we can,\" Scherf said.

Scherf said many tracks see half of their wagering coming within a few minutes of post, and more importantly, computer wagering teams—mostly large offshore bettors searching for value and making big bets at the last possible second—account for about 15% of handle now.

\"There will be a big loss of wagering dollars,\" if betting is closed before the horses enter the starting gate, Scherf said.

http://www.bloodhorse.com/horse-racing/articles/52235/tra-adopts-wagering-protocol-measures

[P-Dub]

BitPlayer Wrote:

> \"There will be a big loss of wagering dollars,\" if
> betting is closed before the horses enter the
> starting gate, Scherf said.


So you mean to tell me that if EVERYONE knows when the windows close, say at 1 or 2 MTP, that these people can\'t get their bets in before that time?? This guy is just sure that the money will just disappear from the pools if the close of betting is moved up a minute??

I don\'t believe that at all.

[yankndixie]

I could not agree more P-Dub. If 1 MTP was the cutoff all the late money would come in all the same. The only difference would be when they are off the odds will remain constant instead of a change at the 1/4 pole.

[sighthound]

Yes, but the odds still wouldn\'t change until a minute after wagering closed.  You\'d still watch your odds rise or drop after betting was stopped. Even if horses hadn\'t left the gate yet.

[P-Dub]

sighthound Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes, but the odds still wouldn\'t change until a
> minute after wagering closed.  You\'d still watch
> your odds rise or drop after betting was stopped.
> Even if horses hadn\'t left the gate yet.


I don\'t think players mind this nearly as much as the odds changing as they turn for home.

[TGJB]

Sight-- that\'s not the problem. The problem is that given that they can hack into NASA, an antiquated system with a thousand entry points is a sitting duck for past posting and screwing with time codes. The only way to completely protect against that is to stop betting when they begin to load, and fire a complete list of the bets to another computer which is sealed off before they start.

The good news is that some people in high places are starting to take this problem seriously.

[sighthound]

I agree \"antiquated system\" is the key there.

[miff]

I\'m told that NYRA has \"audit\" software that combs the live pools looking for possible past posting/betting irregularities from sites that feed into their pools. Have not noticed any late drop in odds as the horses are running as of late.

Mike

[imallin]

Exactly. If bettors have the ability to bet after the \'start\' they are still going to be able to wager after John Q Public has long been locked out.

As far as perception goes, as long as people aren\'t betting after the race starts, i think people will be ok with odds changes as part of the game.

So, lets say the industry gives the fans this bandaid (instead of figuring out a way to make sure no one is betting after stop signal is given) to the fans, than what?

Are we willing to accept others betting after the start as long as we don\'t see odds changes happen turning for home? Regardless of when they close the pools, if they don\'t really address past posting, people who bet after the close signal is given will still have a huge edge.

Keep this in mind. If people really and truly have the ability to wager after the start, what is going to prevent them from waiting till the horses are on the backstretch to make their wagers? John Q will have been long locked out while the past posters will be waiting until the backstretch to make their plays anyway.

[Frost King]

What is the big problem with closing the betting 2-3 minutes before the gates open, so that ALL THE MONEY is calculated into the pools. We are so accustomed to having the money stop when the bells ring that the gates open. When we play the lottery, is not the cut-off 2-3 hours before the drawing? So what is a couple of minutes to save the integrity of the sport?

[JR]

Sure. The large outfits will simply get shut out, pack up their bags, and move on. How absolutely stupid is that statement. You don\'t suppose they could get the shit together maybe a minute or so sooner? Or, do they actually enjoy some time stamp advantage and without it, they will find another \"game\"?