WTC Distaff

[Michael D.]

let\'s root for indian vale and sweet symphony in their next races. if they win, we are looking at a breeder\'s cup race for the ages: cordero on the undefeated ap indy filly indian vale battling his protege johnny v on the defending champion ashado, bailey riding the undefeated and brilliant ap indy filly sweet symphony, and castellano ready to pounce with the brilliant, but inconsistent filly society selection. who do you like in this one?

[richiebee]

Dont forget Stella Jayne and In the Gold (both love Bel). I thought Cordero was only riding Indian Vale at Philly. I love \"the Chimp\" but don\'t want to see him making a comeback. I would think he is earning more now as JV\'s agent as he was as a rider.

[Michael D.]

richie,
in the gold will flatten out like a pancake, i can guarantee that. i did forget about stellar jane though. she loses bailey to sweet symphony, but it\'s likely godolphin will find an adequate replacement.

[jimbo66]

Michael,

You have to realize, Richiebee and I have a sore spot for In the Gold.  In the field you describe, In the Gold would be 30-1 and you are right, likely to flatten out like a pancake.  But nonetheless, she would be on a few of my tickets.

You are right though in that the Distaff has the chance to be the race of the year with field shaping up for it.  Lets hope the field stays together.  I also think that the fact that this is the filly race sheds some light on the discussion I mentioned earlier as to the reasons why we have watered down fields.  There is significantly less money to be made having a top race mare who can produce one foal a year, than a stallion who can produce many many more.  Funny how these minor injuries that cause early retirement happen way more disproportionately to colts than to fillies.  Jerry, I really think that puts at least a minor hole in the theory that a lot of this early retirement is based on horses running so fast that they break down easier.  I know economics have always been there, but it seems to be even more so a factor now.

9 million bucks for a storm cat colt.  A lot the clown\'s posts about Storm Cat were a crock, but lets face it, he is correct that Storm Cat is not exactly crankkng out classic winners and he certainly gets the best mares avaiable.

[Michael D.]

Jim,
as i mentioned earlier, lifetime starts for geldings are decreasing at the same rate as lifetime starts for the rest. it\'s the evolution of the breed and the wind em up nature of the game that is responsible for the unsoundness of today\'s horses. making them go on and on with the help of new medicine doesn\'t help either. i would guess that both indian vale and sweet symphony wind up having soundness issues. they are both good sized ap indy fillies with mr prospector on the dam side. their legs might not be strong enough to support what they do on the track for an extended period of time. i would be happy with eight or nine lifetime starts out of either.

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

Jimbo, its hard for a stallion to get multiple Classic winners. To my knowledge the last four to do so were Mr. Prospector, Danzig, Halo and Alydar.

Storm Cat now has 1 classic winner of 2 classics. Tabasco Cat. He had him back in 1994. Storm Cat is about 22. At this Stage of Alydar\'s career Alydar was dead. But before he was waxed by Lundy he had 3 classic winners of 4 races and others such as:

Criminal Type
Turkoman
Dare and Go

Just to name a few.

The same is true of the other 3 stallions mentioned.

Interesting article upon how the big ticket Yearlings have been disasters:

http://sports.espn.go.com/sports/horse/columns/story?columnist=finley_bill&id=2163840

Storm Cat has been a successful sire, but he\'s passing on headstrong speed and infirmity the combination of which is not going to result in many stars or Classic horses.

They got Giant\'s Causeway at Coolmore in Kentucky earning 200K per cover. Its hard to keep track of them all, but to my knowledge he\'s had five notable runners:

Shamardal-One dirt flop, 6 turf successes (1 at 10.5 marks) broke down training and retired after 7 races
Maid\'s Causeway- EuroTurf
My Typhoon-      EuroTurf

Noble Causeway - Stakes placed. 9 races and looks done
First Samurai  - Outfooted Henny Hughes in Grade I Hopeful (another grandson of Storm Cat) while bearing in all over the place.

On the U.S. record Giant\'s should have about a 25,000 stud fee. After the Breeders Cup maybe 15,000. He\'s better with Turf horses. Guess they figure to try and get the Eurobidders flying over here like they did for Northern Dancer\'s. It\'s early, but think they\'d be better off sending him to England. Northern Dancer never missed the money Dirt or Turf and had bigger American races (Classics) under his belt, though to my knowledge he never sired a Classic winner. Giant\'s Causeway is earning Dancer Stud fees in his first year...lol

Re WTC I hope Cordero doesnt ride the Distaff. He\'s 62 and took a vicious fall when he retired. If he rides in it, I\'ll bet on him.


 the last jimbo66 Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
 
>
> 9 million bucks for a storm cat colt.  A lot the
> clown\'s posts about Storm Cat were a crock, but
> lets face it, he is correct that Storm Cat is not
> exactly crankkng out classic winners and he
> certainly gets the best mares avaiable.
>
>

jimbo,

I think you made a great point about the fillies.

People tend to focus on one factor or another, but it\'s probably a little bit of everything. Some of the early retirements are soundness issues, but at the margin if I have a top horse and he has a setback the economics change the thought process.

Many owners sit down and figure out how much they can make if they send a mildly injured horse to a farm for a few months and start all over vs. what they are being offered to retire him immediately vs the risks of either action. At one price you might take a shot at running him some more because you love the game and aren\'t giving up too much etc... At another price you\'d have to be a madman, extremely wealthy, or think the horse can increase his value very significantly if he\'s given another shot on the track etc... to not retire the horse and cash in immediately.

I think it\'s a miracle that we may see more of Afleet Alex (or even Belamy Road)because pretty much every other colt with a setback has been retired.

No matter, that filly race is looking great and don\'t forget we did a lose a few of the tough 3YOs like Smuggler and a few others that might have developed some more.

 

[P.Eckhart]

Giants nabbed 3 classics with his first crop, French Guineas, French Derby (Shamardal) and English Guineas (Footstepsinthesand). Both retired hurt.

[NoCarolinaTony]

Yes the\'ll bring in Detori to run 6-7 wide......


NC Tony