BC Figures

[TGJB]

They\'re up. I\'m going to be reviewing the Juvy turf races as horses run back-- it was either have the colts run terrible, or give out a lot of tops to the fillies. I did the latter, but it was a very close call.

[covelj70]

JB, thanks as always for doing this

I find the post mortem very helpful to improve for next year (which God knows I need to do).

appreciate it

[miff]

Amongst many to choose from, the performances by Goldenscents and Tapiture were \"equal\"....personal favorite!

[TGJB]

The FIGURES were equal. We make clear the things we measure, and those we don\'t.

Waiting for you to weigh in on Violette/Finley.

[miff]

Violette is NOT a friend of the player, imo.Violette becoming immersed in the political side of the game and is clueless/unconcerned with serious issues adversely affecting gamblers.There are anti Finley forces at venues outside of NY regarding the National Lasix issue which will come to a head soon.

Horrific handle and attendance results at recently concluded Belmont fall meet more than an aberration.Many players at their limit with issues important to them just not addressed.

A public meeting on the future structure of NYRA is scheduled in Albany on 11-18 by the NY State Assembly.Not sure if attending public will be allowed to speak.

[Kasept]

I\'m not a statistics guy but I\'m guessing net 40 races taken off the turf (v. LY) might contribute to the \'not aberration\'.

[miff]

40 races off the grass not that relevant vs the whole meet.

Dave Grening DRF:

Steep declines at Belmont fall meet
Due in part due to wet weather, Belmont Park's fall meet suffered near double-digit declines in total and ontrack handle compared to a year ago.

All-sources handle for the 38-day meet was $294,710,551, a 9.8-percent decrease from last year's total of $326,878,686 when 37 cards of racing were conducted. Ontrack handle for this year's meet was $42,697,719, a 9.6 percent decline from last year's figure of $47,238,016.

Attendance at this year's meet was 102,566, an 18.9-percent decrease from last year's figure of 126,469. Small crowds this fall prompted NYRA to close the third and fourth floors of Belmont for weekday programs in October.

Belmont conducted 365 races at this year's fall meet, compared to 361 last fall. Inclement weather forced 47 scheduled turf races to be moved to the main track this year compared to only seven last year. All totaled, Belmont conducted 152 turf races this fall compared to 191 last year.

Average field size at this fall's meet was 8.0 (2,927 starters for 365 races) compared to 8.4 (3,016 for 361 races) last fall.

NYRA emphasized "big-event" days this year but suffered declines on its three biggest days of the fall meet. Total handle on Jockey Club Gold Day was $19.9 million, down from $22.1 million a year ago. The following Saturday _ a card featuring the Champagne and Frizette _ was decimated by rain and handled just $10.7 million, compared to $15.2 million a year ago. Finally, the New York Showcase Day program handled $12.9 million, down from $13.4 million last year.

[Boscar Obarra]

Do they ever check on the net participation of Whale computer bettors? Changes in handle can come for many reasons, not just the \'public\' betting more or less.

 I notice wide variance in what could be called \'big punches\', though it\'s hard to tell if they are not playing or just changing the way/when the money is sent in.

 If a big group found NY was not producing a net gain, their withdrawl could easily skew the handle lower.

 Since they are all anonymous and ain\'t talking, how do we know?

[miff]

Box,

Good point.There are management info systems that racing execs look at. They can compare hub to hub flow handle from different time periods.They can monitor batch/computer generated wagers very closely, whale watching.As you know, wagers come in from all over the world these days thru a hub(a pool integrity concern imo)

Tough to get past recent handle trending down at SPA, Del Mar, Kee, Belmont meets along with other smaller venues.Breeders Cup handle was up and Del Mar did well with its initial fall meet replacing Hollywood.

Good news for players is that Gulfstream Park expects it\'s coming winter meet to be it\'s best ever with over 5,300 stall applications, a record.Several stalwart NY outfits bailing out of winter Aqu meet in favor of GP portends horrific quality at Aqueduct.

Mike

[jma11473]

Handle was down 10 percent nationwide, 10 percent at Keeneland...it\'s not as if just NY was down but the rest of the nation was booming. There are so many options for the gambling dollar right now and horse racing is not one of the appealing ones. That\'s the controlling factor, not whether there are four more turf races in a month or four less, or whatever \"clueless clown\" is a board member while those races are run.

[phil23]

I was a bit struck by the fact that Jockey Club Gold Cup day was down from 22.1M to 19.9M. That was a great card/day and unlike the Champagne card the following week, not decimated by weather. For that day especially to be down 10%, eeeash...not so good.

Don\'t think it\'s specifically NYRA\'s fault (for that matter think between Panza\'s scheduling/new race cards and those new HD streams, that NYRA has made tons of HUGELY positive changes this year) but as jma11473 said...lot of other gambling options these days.

With a lot less take.

[miff]

Phil,

Respectfully,I beg to differ. The state of racing in NY today is substantially NYRA\'s fault.In spite of huge subsidies from the slots, they did zero for the players in a meaningful/monetary way.Not a dollar for pool seeding, reduced takeout or anything along those lines. In fact, NYRA recently raised admission and rubber stamped a surcharge on NY gamblers that hold ADW accounts out of state.

They can stick their flat screen TV\'s where the sun don\'t shine.NYRA is completely out of touch with it\'s core customer base or just dont care.Efforts to get anything meaningful done for the players is met with fierce opposition.

Mike

[phil23]

I hear you Mike. All those problems are not going away and obviously respect yours and any NY\'ers opinion as they are much closer to it. My perspective was from a non live attendee/NY wagerer p.o.v. (not affected by admission/adw stuff).

Certainly with Genting $\'s takeout reductions might (would...?) be nice. 100% concur on that.

Still think Panza+website improvements have been very very beneficial though.

lol to your flat screens shot...that got a good laugh on this chilly Saturday morning.

[gteasy]

Suggest you publish your own list of champions by division and HOY.

[Kasept]

Along those lines, Dan Borislow\'s passing has hurt.