Pletcher vs. Baffert--any thoughts on the last month?

Dana666 · April 29, 2012, 01:26:22 PM

I\'d be interested to hear any thoughts on the way Pletcher has handeled Gemologist and Baffert\'s handling of \'Bode. I\'m not sure what to read if anything into these two colts with very different lead-ups to the derby.

Gemologist will have had just two works since the Wood (and an extra week of rest), and he\'s been sequestered away in Boynton Beach while \'Bode has had two works in the last week, and sharp ones at that.

How do you read these two appraoches? Bode seems much sharper, but it is Pletcher\'s plan to bring Gem in very fresh? Would you say that \'Bode is just doing that well, in which case you\'d like the aggressive training, or does Baffert just do the same thing with every horse regardless? Does he fear \'Bode might be lacking bottom having not raced as a 2 year old, and that\'s why the aggressive training?

Is Pletcher\'s easy training regime a sign of strength? Does he think Gem is so rock solid, he doesn\'t want to take anything out of him, and thus he might explode and run a new top on derby day? Baffert has had of course much more Derby success, so should we put more faith in his plan? If it was anyone other than Pletcher, I\'d be inclined to not like such a training plan bringing a horse into the derby but Pletcher is so good with fresh horses--he\'s kind of like Frankel used to be, take a horse off a layoff and have him run his best, not too many trainers could do that with success.

I\'m not sure how to read these two very different approaches.

toppled · April 29, 2012, 03:25:00 PM

When I 1st heard of Gemologist\'s slow work today, I was concerned because he\'s my top choice (among a bunch who I will be using in O/D DDs)and will get my largest DD. However, I then looked at the Super Saver PPs going into the 2010 Derby. If you look, you\'ll see that Super Saver was the most recently raced of the TAP horses and only had one 4f maintenance work between the Ark. Derby and the Kentucky Derby. Gemologist had a 5f work on 4/1, raced on 4/7, had a 5f work on 4/20 and worked 4f today, 4/29. considering that nobody worked faster than him today, I\'m not concerned-I believe he\'s plenty fit & if he\'s good enough & doesn\'t get into trouble, he\'ll win. If he loses it will be because there are better horses in the race or he had bad luck in the running.
Baffert is Baffert, he likes to keep his horses active. If he ever backed off on a Derby horse, then it would be a reason for concern. If you look at the PPs I\'ve linked, you\'ll see that in 2010 he worked Lookin at Lucky in a typical Baffert manner & I remember that LAL was getting rave notices Derby week. Unfortunately, LAL drew the rail, got into trouble & lost.
So, in conclusion, they\'re both being consistent with what has been successful for them in prior Derby wins.

http://www1.drf.com/tc/kentuckyderby/2010/pps/derby2010classic.pdf

Dana666 · April 29, 2012, 06:52:54 PM

Thanks! People have compared Gem to Saver, and I can see that. I don\'t see the similarity w/Bode to Lucky though b/c Lucky was raced and very accomplished at 2. The big question is does the lack of 2 year exp. hurt bode?

Donut · April 29, 2012, 07:02:59 PM

I think pletcher lost his best horse for the derby FOY week in ALGO. SS was faster and better. No comment on BODE.

gteasy · April 29, 2012, 11:40:18 PM

I look at Bodemeister and Gemologist the same way...too much effort in a small window...Bode\'s top is too close to the Derby, and Gemologist\'s pair were too close together...I prefer the way Pletcher has prepared El Padrino.

How would you schedule your horse to run a top on Derby Day?...I still like Hansen\'s better-than-looked two-back top, followed by the low-stress prep on synthetic.

Baffert and Pletcher train like \"honey badgers\".

Gerard · April 30, 2012, 05:59:52 AM

Does anyone read anything into Garcia being the one that was working Bode?

big18741 · April 30, 2012, 06:06:17 AM

Garcia gets on a lot of Baffert horses in the AM even when he isn\'t riding them in races.

plasticman · April 30, 2012, 02:24:32 PM

Wasnt Dialed In \"sequestered\" by Zito and then there were rumors surrounding the Derby that he wasnt \'doing well\'? I always get concerned when these horses arent ripping around Churchill in the mornings getting used to the surface.

Why would prepping a horse away from Churchill be a good thing?

Wouldnt you want to get him used to the surface and all the hub bub?

drshillito · April 30, 2012, 02:30:09 PM

Barclay Tagg said, in the case of Funny Cide, that if a horse doesn\'t truly care for the surface, then the horse will get hind end sore from galloping and working over it. He believed that if you ship in a few days before the race, then the horse will not get sore and either he will like the track and run his race or not like the track and run up the track. I believe he shipped Funny Cide in on the Tuesday/Wednesday/Thursday before the race???

justwin · April 30, 2012, 02:34:15 PM

Pletcher was worried about the weather in KY so he stayed in FL where the rain is usually a lot less and he can get his works in when he wants & on a dry track. It didn\'t work this year but since it will be 85 degrees on Saturday Gemologist & El padrino won\'t have to adjust to the heat. Gemologist already has 2 wins at CD. i don\'t think the surface is an issue with him.