Phipps Stable and the Derby

[Wrongly]

Personal Ensign was the dam of both My Flag and Tradionally.  My Flag was the dam for BC Juvy champ Storm Flag Flying.

[Bally Ache]

Richiebee,

My previous post is not meant as a knock on the Phipps family who we both know are old line class horseowners. I just don\'t think it\'s appropriate to canonize them for not running a horse who\'s still eligible for NW2.


Parenthetically, do you remember Mrs. Henry Carnegie Phipps, who was the grand dame of the stable for many years?  It was widely reported that she was less than thrilled with PEB\'s caricature of her which often appeared in the DRF.  It was there frequently because they had a barnload of runners in those days (many of them Bold Rulers)

One year, in the Garden State Stakes, which was the richest race in the world at that time, they ran a FIVE horse entry.

[miff]

Lost,

Talking about derby types. EZ was 18 years ago, check your facts.

Mike

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

The Phipps mares have produced multiple champions including Inside Information, Personal Ensign, Relaxing (The actual dam of Easy Goer), Easy Goer and Rhythm. Theres more, including Buckpasser. I can\'t list them all. Shug is a real horseman, he\'s not gonna cheat. His stable wouldn\'t allow it even if he wanted to. Shug will be back with a good horse one year. Unless you are medicating them you have to be a little lucky.

Lost Cause Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> \"Bee,
>
> You forgot the 8th wonder of the racing world. All
> the brilliant Phipps mares never threw a champion
> or anything close to one. It kinda stamps breeding
> as a somewhat random endeavor.It\'s been a source
> of silent pain for Shug that none of the mares
> throw speed, who woulda thunk it.
>
> Mike\"
>
> I think you have lost it...Cadillacing had Easy
> Goer...I think every Personal Ensign foal has been
> a graded winner..That is to name a few...check
> your facts before posting false remarks..

[TGJB]

I\'m not getting this whole conversation. 99% of the Phipps runners are homebreds. If their mares aren\'t producing all those sw, what, the stork brought them?

[miff]

Nobody reads well, Colts that run and are factors in the TC. Whats their names the last 15 years?

Mike

[Chuckles_the_Clown2]

Well I can read and \"Champion\" has a distinct meaning in regard to Horse Racing. \"Triple Crown Event Winner\" or \"Triple Crown Winner\" have different meanings too. If Miff meant to say a Phipps 3YO Colt has not been effective in the Triple Crown Events recently, he would be correct. But that\'s not what he said.

As far as breeding goes Distorted Humor may be the hottest item in modern breeding. His stud fee should be greater than Storm Cat, because his get have better potential at the distance and to my eye are more solidly made. Let the Phipps band of mares breed to him and lets see if they show some speed.

TGJB Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I\'m not getting this whole conversation. 99% of
> the Phipps runners are homebreds. If their mares
> aren\'t producing all those sw, what, the stork
> brought them?

[miff]

Chuck,

The board was initially discussing why Phipps would not rush Sightseeing into the Derby and that\'s what I was referring to. Correct, I should have said colts.

About 7 years ago we were having a drink in Saratoga and Shug joined us with his wife. Talk about horses led to a question from my friend Carl about the lack of participation by Shug/Phipps in the TC races. Shug said\"I\'m not getting any colts with speed, how can I compete\"

Incidentally, from memory,most of the Phipps mares go to very good stallions.

Mike

[SoCalMan2]

Am not so interested in this thread, but, for those who are, this article may be of interest --

http://www.kentuckyderby.com/2002/derby_coverage/derby_news/derby_news_05022002.html

[fkach]

Personally, I think they are looking at his Wood performance and saying he more or less inherited second after No Biz disposed of the other speeds (despite being rank and fighting) and then repulsed AGS\'s later more serious bid. I don\'t know how you can come away from that race thinking anything other than No Biz is much better than the Shug horse right now.  

If you think AGS ran subpar and was used harder early (which IMO he did/was), you come away from the Wood thinking that Sightseeing is a very promising colt that is moving in the right direction  but he didn\'t really accomplish all that much in that spot by finishing second.

He would be a deserving longshot in the Derby despite finishing relatively close to No Biz in the Wood. (keep in mind I am not raving about No Biz. I\'m just comparing those two)

However, if you assume he continues moving in the right direction, later this year he may be hitting his best stride just when some of the horses that competed in the Derby are starting to tale off. Why waste him in the Derby where he is likely to make a run and finish mid pack when they can keep him fresh, develop him, and pick up some good checks along the way waiting for a spot where he has a legit shot at a big dance.