Mind boggling. They handle 10 million on races that wouldn\'t handle 300k here, and the apparent transparency of the racing is unequaled.
Training races and gallops online for FREE. Here, secret and misreported workouts. ahem.
And now this. Which means they are handing 20 million a race, or more?
http://racing.scmp.com/freeservice/news/news20141123a.asp
Makes Saratoga look like Green Mountain.
Surprised you don\'t go after this market.
Here in America, horsemen act as if its their right to be trainers. Over there, they realize its a privilege. That\'s the difference.
I continue to be amazed, they just bet 16 Million on a race with 100k purse.
Even more enchanted with the professional level of the commentary patter.
PS I\'m way too smart to have two cents on it, but I\'ve been facinated with the fact that they run first timers vs winners there regularly. Not sure why.
I recalled before todays 4th that this guy John Size had put one like that over last week, and I\'d watched the \'training races\' after the fact. , and was impressed with the \'finesse\' of the work.
He just did it again at 45-1. Same style too, big late kick. Is it a Red Board in Hong Kong or do they use a different color?
Not to spoil the message, but 1 HK$ is equal to $0.129 US$.
This the 16 million in HK$ would be about $2.0million US. Still a lot of money...but....lets keep it in perspective.
Not to spoil the message, but 1 HK$ is equal to $0.129 US$.
This the 16 million in HK$ would be about $2.0million US. Still a lot of money...but....lets keep it in perspective.
Hi NC Tony,
At present, it is reported that the daily HKJC handle averages $150 million per day, US Dollars.
Mike
Miff
The article referenced Dollars and it was a South Asia Paper. My Company CEo is headquartered there. I\'ve been there and all currency ost everything is posted in Local currency, otherwise, they would state in other currency in their papers.
I\'ll take your word for it, but would love to see the reference.
NC Tony
Tony,
Also been there, crowds insane with frenzy type betting.On many occasions have heard or read about massive size of HK pools. Honestly can\'t put my hands on anything to confirm the HK handle figs right now.
Mike
Supposedly the Chinese speaking bookmakers hanging at at the Chatham Square OTB were handling more than the OTB, and that was the highest handle one in the city.
Tony;
The link takes you to a PDF on the site of the International Federation of Horseracing Authorities. Page 40 of the PDF gives you annual flat races by country for 2013; page 42, purses; page 44, handle.
http://www.horseracingintfed.com/resources/Annual_Report_2013.pdf
Mike is correct. In 2013, Hong Kong ran 771 races, with a handle of just under 10 billion Euros (everything is converted to Euros in the chart). That works out to an average handle of 12,368,699 Euro per race. Convert that to dollars (x1.3) and you get an average of about 16 million US dollars bet per race.
Some other interesting items there. I will try to post some later.
Bob
Thats ok Tony, I accept your apology ;-)
PS Congrats to whoever crushed the EX and TRI in the first race today at AQU. Paid $540, way too low, and the super paid 6,600 with the FAVE 4th, in a 7h race.
Likely know the answer but thought would inquire anyway. Given that it\'s the biggest day internationally till Dubai World Cup night (where we can get sheets..and much thanks for this) and given that it\'s just four races (so in theory many fewer horses to have to track down), any chance of some sheets?
We\'ll look into it on Thursday and let you know. It\'s a long shot.
May need Rocky (Mathcapper) to report on the 1st race double at Aq Wednesday. First race winner paid 3.90. Second race winner paid 8.60. DD paid 57.00.
Yeah, the Domino horse in the 2nd got POUNDED in the win pool. Probably got keyed in the Ex\'s and Tri\'s as well.
Not so in the Super\'s or DD\'s though, which both came back very generous. Based on the final odds, the DD should\'ve paid only $19 instead of $57. The reason it didn\'t was because the horse was 9-1 in the doubles (more or less in line with the 10-1 ML) vs 3-1 on the board.
The win pool is generally more efficient than the DD pools. When the money shows like that on the board but not in the DD\'s, it\'s usually a good indicator the horse is gonna run today.
Should have noted you were right too, Boscar.
Some other notes on Hong Kong vs US ...
Avg field size for HK is 12.49, versus 7.87 in US
Avg starts per horse, per year, 7.57 in HK versus 6.28 in US
Avg purse in HK - 107,914 Euro per race, versus 15,811 Euro in US
Avg handle in HK - 12.4 million Euro per race, versus 184,000 Euro in US
Finally, HK returns a shade more than 84% of handle to bettors. Yup. A blended takeout of less than 16%
Of course, you only get to play two days per week in HK. Wonder how many racing dates NYRA will be running in a couple of years.
I\'ve taken a look at the Group I races. There\'s 49 horses, some of which we don\'t even have in the database, all of whom need work to fill with no guarantees that we have all the requisite data necessary to do the job. It\'s a no go.
Thanks for considering it Alan. Cheers.
I hadn\'t come across the takeout rate. When you say blended, is it lower for win?
\"When you say blended, is it lower for win?\"
Can\'t say, but I would guess so. The \"handle\" page in that PDF I linked to summarized all betting by country (handle, returned to bettors, %).
Worst countries for takeout ...
Turkey - 50%
Venezuela - 44%
Brazil - 30%
Argentina - 28%
France - 25.7%
Japan - 25.1%
The best:
Ireland - 10.9%*
Great Britain - 11.1%*
South Africa - 11.2%*
Australia - 14%
Hong Kong - 14%
Those takeouts marked with * are via bookmakers. Those countries also have tote betting with much higher takeout, but 99% of the handle in those countries goes through the bookmakers (one of the reasons it is so expensive going to the races in UK and Ireland).
Australia also has a tote and bookmakers, but both return 86% and the handle is split fairly evenly between the books and the tote.
Turkey - 50%
Is that how the country got named?
and Japan at 25% ? didn\'t expect it to be that high and no fig given for USA, presume it\'s because of all the wildly differing takeouts.
While enjoying tonights spectacular and bringing my excel code up to speed to handle some Hong Kong pool peculiarities, I found this pdf
http://www.horseracingintfed.com/resources/worldmedia/icha_2007/chang_2007e.pdf
I think those low takeouts reported INCLUDE the 10% house rebate for LARGE individual bets, so the rate mere mortals pay is
17.5 for win and 25% !!! for exotics.
It used to be that the USA got all of the extra horses from the UK. Now if they get up to a certain RP number they\'re quickly sold off to HK. We get the ones just below that level and the maidens who aren\'t rated.