Needs to learn to be more diplomatic--on ESPN post-race, he whined about the track and the fact that GP yielded several track records. Truth be told, it looked to me like Quality Road was the better horse today--perhaps Dunkirk bounced off the ridiculous top he ran in prior allowance race. The horse (Dunkirk) looked tired after the race, whereas Quality Road looked majestic. Horse Racing has always been a sport where principals conduct themselves with some class and dignity. Todd Pletcher--you did yourself no good by whining like a little bitch. Learn to be gracious and move on to the next dance.
Race tracks that fast ruin good horses. I wouldn\'t be surprised to see several who raced over the course today come back with minor injuries.
I disagree with him needing to be more diplomatic. We have too many horse racing personalities who just give you the politically correct answer. No offense, but i want to hear true feelings. If Pletcher did his diplomatic thing, what good does that do? You can hear the PC answer from 99% of all trainers, riders and owners across this great land on a regular basis. I want the truth, i can handle it.
What Pletcher said was true, so I don\'t have a problem with him being blunt about it.
Whether its true or not is up for debate. What i do like however is that he shared his true feelings.
I think the reason he was so upset is because Collmus said that his horse \'took the lead\' in the racecall. He might actually stuck a nose in front, but the winner was always under a hold at that point and wasn\'t really asked for his best. I bet on the winner and i was never worried because the jock had him totally in hand around the far turn.
Collmus \'teased\' Pletcher and made him think he had a shot. Until....until the bias pulled the rug out from under him. Bias schmias, the winner was best and Pletcher was 2nd best.
No dirt race was won by a horse worse than 3rd at the pace call. A speed favoring surface,but not an intense speed bias,imo.
Several horses were inside all the way and ran ok, did not appear that the rail was really bad.
Mike
All in,
Bias schmias, the winner was best and Pletcher was 2nd best
QR was probably the best even though D lost some ground.It will be a real shame
if D doesn\'t get in the derby because of the guaranteed spot for the euro
horse.
mjs
Plether IMO, is full of himself. The guy was mentored under Lukas and his father was very influential for where he is. The game blows my mind at times. I am not sure these super trainers and owners, understand why the game exists.
Miff,
I don\'t think the bias was that bad. As somebody who grew up betting speed horses at Monmouth, where whoever made the lead, seemingly won the race, regardless of quality, I didn\'t think yesterday was bad. When I see a race card where seemingly inferior frontrunners get to a golden rail, on the lead, and outrun their figures, that is a speed bias. While many horses near the lead, won their races yesterday at GP, I don\'t see any jump ups from inferior speed horses. The best horses in most dirt races on the card were stalkers/front runners, and they ran like it.
Curious to see when JB does the figures if he sees a bias.
I think he was sending a message to Butch Lehr at Churchill.
just an fyi--Congaree offspring/relatives running some big numbers recenty--horse who finished 2nd at Sunland in $800k race was a Congaree--I think Baffert has most if not all of them in his barn.
I don\'t know what you all were watching but there was definitely a bias at GP Saturday and if you watched Sunday you would have noticed the EXACT same thing. It was VERY TOUGH to make up much of any ground on the dirt course making Dunkirks effort even more impressive. Horses that didn\'t figure on TG made the lead and re-broke at the top of the stretch just like Quality Road. We are horseplayers and are always looking for angles. To me, the Fla. Derby was a race impacted by bias. If I recall correctly, didn\'t GP do the same thing on a big race day earlier in the season....soup up the track to make it real fast and it left closers with very little chance.
Hi Jim,
There is some pretty sophisticated bias stuff that I use along with common sense, like you. The data has the day speed favoring but not speed biased, there is a difference. I agree that when the best horses going in wire, you have to careful to declare speed bias. One sign I look for is when they line up all day with little position changes and nothing comes from too for back.If you check the charts for the day at GP,you will note that come from be hinders did not do well and yes, the best horses going in were often speed types that were winning.
Also noticed that whenever a surface is \"fake\" fast,like GP Sat, closers/plodders and one paced types do not do well generally and there is a reason.
As far as I know, TG will identify a dead rail but not a speed bias.
For the Pletcher bashers, I guess you have not heard MANY trainers whine about the track surface getting their horses beat.Dunkirk was outrun by QR by much more than the final margin of victory and on several racing levels.
There is no question that the DIRT strip at GP played faster than any other day of the meet.Pletcher was more pissed when the GM of GP advised him that they did NOT scrape/juice the track.Must have been an act of God especially since the wind was blowing hard all day sucking moisture/tightness out of the surface.
Mike
The GP track has been very kind to pace-pressers all meet. I do not believe this would have come as a surprise to TAP as he\'s been running there for, what, 3 months now?
TAP usually is a bit of a cry-baby anyway, but usually it\'s of the X-horse ran badly and needs to be retired because of a \"fever\" or \"hoof bruise\" variety. It\'s never that his horse is just not good enough to win on a particular day.
I think you are being a little tough on Pletcher. Only a day before \"Bling on the Beach\" was celebrated here in So Florida Pletcher provided a little bling of his own to the Florida Derby. The explanation below from Track Management\" might be worthy of some more bling I do not know.
Mindful that a track record also was set in the prior race, the Swale Stakes, Pletcher said, \"I just don\'t understand why on big days we have to change the surface. It\'s been safe and fair the whole meet. I\'m not saying we were going to win on yesterday\'s track, but we would have had a more fair chance.\"
Bill Murphy, Gulfstream\'s president, said, \"Here\'s the difference this week: We had three inches of rain last Sunday and we had no rain all winter. That settles the track and makes things faster. We prepared it the same way.\"
If the track was speed favoring, Dunkirk certainly didn\'t benefit from it. So he\'s either as good as he looks on paper or better than he looks on paper. I\'m also not sure the race development helped him much. That track was blazing fast. 23.2 and 46.4 are not especially quick fractions on that kind of track. If anything, the middle part of the race on the turn was the quick part and Dunkirk was rallying wide into contention at that point. Perhaps that\'s why he didn\'t finish as well as might be expected.
Beyer gave the race a figure of 103. That looks a little slow to me. I noticed that some people said it was windy at GP that day. The FD was the only 9 furlong race of the day. Perhaps the wind was strong enough to impact both the fractions and final time relative to other races that day.
Silver Charm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Bill Murphy, Gulfstream\'s president, said, \"Here\'s
> the difference this week: We had three inches of
> rain last Sunday and we had no rain all winter.
> That settles the track and makes things faster. We
> prepared it the same way.\"
That\'s absolute garbage...Every time there is a big race day at every track..The track is made to produce ridiculous times with speed horses running very well regardless of fractions set......Watch what happens at AQU this Saturday for the Wood, the early races will seem okay and then as they get closer to the Wood the track will suddenly change to a lightning fast track....It\'s crazy..Pletcher was dead on..