Who ordered it? Lot of people liked this horse. Kenny plays by the rules. While the CHRB has a history of hiding and burying evidence....
https://x.com/Hinesite/status/1984365483752374315?t=vyzz4_bqvVFo2JcmR5b__w&s=19
Per Vegas Handicapping Show. Email was sent earlier to all CAW notifying them.
Same owners. They can go back home and run in the Clark. And the 2YO in the Jockey Club. They dont need the hassle.....
The connections of Arizona Blaze just indicated on the feed that they had no idea why the vets scratched their horse either.
So the #11 can win hopefully
Oy vey.
The CHRB has nothing to do with the Breeders\' Cup vet team.
Regulatory/Official Veterinarians are employed or contracted by the California Horse Racing Board (CHRB), a state agency, to ensure compliance with safety and integrity regulations. The CHRB also contracts with the University of California, Davis, to provide an Equine Medical Director.
The veterinarians for the Breeders\' Cup are hired through a collaboration of several organizations, primarily the Breeders\' Cup Limited (BCL), the host state\'s racing commission (the California Horse Racing Board (CHRB) for the 2025 event at Del Mar), the Horseracing Integrity and Safety Authority (HISA), and the host track (the Del Mar Thoroughbred Club for 2025).
#facts
BTW dont know if its 100% but one of the Plaintiffs in the recent Case Filed said there may he aome news on the CAW soon. Fans are SCREAMING mad
Same story with White Abarrio, connex are saying he\'s never missed a day of training and is 100% sound. They were not given any explanation until Sunday morning, per a bloodhorse article.
Singleton when he comes back. I had him way on top for BC. He\'s got to be on edge to run.
Doesn\'t White Abarrio have hoof issues. When Dutrow had him, he said the horse has bad feet. He even flew Ian the farrier to the stars out to Santa Anita to have him shod with some Yasha\'s, glue on shoes.
Too bad the search here is broken, would love to recall what was being said HERE about rebates 20 years ago
Here is some of what I know. The Ownership group for WA took all the info they had including scans, tests, records supporting the runners physical condition. Their argument in the saga.
Apparently there was more back and forth throughout the week. 5 minutes before they go into the gate a Vet on Horseback on the Track declares him OUT. A certain Trainer runs 1-2 after two highly competitive runners had been ordered scratched.
The time of 1:34:7 was good but not great. Nysos barely got by a horse, winning by a scant nose, after the other one had run an opening quarter in 21:74. Syclla went her mile in 1:35.29. She still had to go another 1/8th.
Both those 1-2 finishers were beatable. But not if you are pulled from the race. Because of the late scratch all tickets in the Pick 6 Pool default to the clear favorite. One race later a 10-1 shot comes in and the Pick 6 pays $83,000 for a $1. Stud Fee commercials are already being filmed for both those Dirt Mile 1-2 Finishers.
Pittsburg Phil just gave a thumbs up from his grave. LT Columbo has been banned from the grounds....
Lawsuit coming?
https://paulickreport.com/news/ray-s-paddock/letter-to-the-editor-white-abarrio-owners-consider-legal-options-after-breeders-cup-scratch
They have no case. It\'s a judgement call. And if you watch the warmup , it wasn\'t all that pretty.
Scratch worthy ? Hard to day. Clocker claims he was not too happy with the horse in the mornings leading up to race.
A judgment call?
From a vet who has never spent more than a day or two around a particular horse I feel is not a good enough reason.
Especially since Saffie went above and beyond producing any test results they asked for.
They were on him for days and to do this at post time doesn’t sit right.
These vet scratches need to have a reason other than a judgement call.
You mean if the vet doesn\'t scratch in the morning, and sees something off during the warmup, when you\'re most likely to detect soreness, its a no go?
That\'s not how it works
Even in NY , they used to let sore horses run. Very rare now , they get scratched well before post time.
I\'m not drinking the conspiracy kool aid.
Help me understand?
These vets have prodded these horses for days.
They asked Saffie for all test results, scans etc and he produced them with no issues.
Then magically at post time they say no go and that’s supposed to pass the eye test?
To this eye it looks like they were after that horse from the beginning.
They’re terrified of having a horse break down on national TV. After what happened at Saratoga a couple of years ago, on Fox, its hard to fault them.
One horse breaking down is one to many IMO. It sucks to have your horse scratched by the vet, but the data supporting the scratches, is pretty much hard to argue against.
How many horses have been scratched and never raced again, or where off for an extended period of time after a scratch.
I have no problem with the vets erring on the side of caution. Isn\'t the horse supposed to come first no matter what?
You\'d think some folks just got off the boat , and horse racing is a mystery to them.
Vet sees something a little suspect in the morning but not enough to force a scratch. Thinks, will see how he comes to the track a day or many hours later after the usual warmups.
Warms up and same or another vet still doesn\'t like what they see. Favoring a leg, not striding out, whatever. This is a Grade 1 on National TV , not a MNR 4000 claimer.
Scratched. I thought this is how the games been played for the last 100+ years.
So are to the point where we need to start handicapping the Vets? Ask anyone who is a Professional Gambler that is part of a heavy wagering syndicate and bets Pro Football.
The Kansas City Chiefs had never lost a game where Clay Martin was Lead Official. Certain NBA Refs the game almost always goes OVER. They call more Fouls. Professionals study this. If one Vet eyeballs more scratches than the others then that\'s important info if you are playing multi race wagers. While some of this sounds ridiculous that is where we are at. NO ONE KNOWS the standards or the rules. Its one mysterious mans judgement.....
Never bet a Reploe horse in the future wagers?
Grande still has not made it back to the races, trained by Todd Pletcher. Repole said he was fine to race.
White Abarrio has soundness issues, bad feet. I am not a vet, nor pretend to be. If the vets are not to be trusted, who should make the call to scratch an unsound horse. The connections are biased, I want to believe the vets are not.
What should have been done? Let the horse run because the connections think the horse is sound. I like to think that the vets speak for the horses.
I don’t think anyone in their right minds ever wants to ever see a horse break down.
Anyone listen to the reason the Japanese horse was scratched? If I heard correctly pretty weak.
I saw a German horse this week every time he walked his left rear leg went straight up. That action was ok, that’s who the horse is and thank goodness he came home safe.
My point is don’t make these owners and trainers jump thru hoops to show medical record after medical record. Gamblers take time to handicap etc etc etc only to say “I don’t likeâ€.
We deserve a reason not an opinion.
And thur all that sorry to say they still had one break down.
That horse Goliath has a condition called stringhalt. War of Will had the same funky gait at a walk. I know it looks bad, but they run fine with it, and is not a factor in horses breaking down.
I just don\'t know what the answer is. The health records & treatment of all horses should be public just like in Hong Kong.
Tamara was scratched and is another horse with large gaps between starts. Obviously has some issues.
Plus medication withdraw. Any permissible treatments wearing off. I am more upset about not knowing what the horse was treated with, and why, than the horse being scratched.
The owners & trainers need to sign a disclosure agreement and let us see every thing.
I just watched the recent work/gallop by White .....
100% not right.
I went back and looked at previous works. Nothing like this .
Maybe biased after the fact, but I don\'t think so
Even the hosts here in the vid thought he was not moving \'typically\' but dismissed it as noise
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g7wYdh6Ijdk
https://paulickreport.com/news/ray-s-paddock/letter-to-the-editor-regulatory-vets-protect-horses-and-racings-social-license-to-operate
Watched the video.
To my eyes I agree definitely not the smoothest looking in the rear.
Then again I have no other gallop videos to compare this to.
We agree on it should be transparency for all.
Good luck
John
I looked at a few others, he didn\'t move like that
I doubt any GR 1 winners present that way pre race.
From strictly a handicapping POV, after WA\'s KyDerby effort, I have always taken the position that he can only produce his best efforts for Saffie Joseph at Gulfstream. In fact, he can only win at GP according to the Saffie trained PP\'s. He was a terrible 2nd choice purely as a handicapper.
Dutrow took the horse to heights SJ couldn\'t achieve with him. That said, Dutrow stated clearly while training him that the horse needs a lot of time in between starts (read between the lines why that may be true and I\'m not being coy here).
I applaud the owners for keeping the horse in training as the game needs stars to continue to run. Unfortunately, he isn\'t even close to the same horse in the hands of Saffie as he was in Rick\'s for that Whitney and Classic double. And when Rick couldn\'t get him to run well following that Classic win and Saffie has only won in friendly F L A since, there surely are some issues for the vets to have their antennas up and the horse on their radar to avoid the result JB described.
If the vets would release a statement similar to this in some manner along with releasing/showing the work out videos that Oscar posted then at least we have something to hang our hats on.
Pletcher on Byk today had some comments regarding the vet situation.
Moving on.
Good Luck.
John
Silver Charm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So are to the point where we need to start
> handicapping the Vets? Ask anyone who is a
> Professional Gambler that is part of a heavy
> wagering syndicate and bets Pro Football.
>
> The Kansas City Chiefs had never lost a game where
> Clay Martin was Lead Official. Certain NBA Refs
> the game almost always goes OVER. They call more
> Fouls. Professionals study this. If one Vet
> eyeballs more scratches than the others then
> that\'s important info if you are playing multi
> race wagers. While some of this sounds ridiculous
> that is where we are at. NO ONE KNOWS the
> standards or the rules. Its one mysterious mans
> judgement.....
KC is 6-0 and 3-3 ATS with Martin, one of those wins a squeaker against an awful Raiders team as a DD favorite. The Chiefs have been great, the Raiders have been shit. A 6 game sample with the far better team beating the shitty one 6 straight isn\'t significant.
Your NBA assertion isn\'t close to accurate. There isn\'t one NBA Ref that \"almost always goes OVER\". Yes, some have Over or Under tendencies. Not one of them is anywhere close to almost always.
Are referee stats useful?? Sure they are, I have a few in my database. But they play a smaller role than people think
6 straight wins in a Money Line parlay is significant. It wasnt 6 straight against the Raiders. You said it yourself.
Always may have been an exaggeration. If its 60% of the time that\'s enough for a professional group like the one Billy Walters described in his Book. They played Coin Toss Selection tendencies. As in do they take the ball or defer. Amd who scores first. He claimed they had $50K maybe $100K on that Parlay in the Super Bowl with Arizona and Pittsburgh
And NFL Official could call holding on every play. A Breeders Cup Vet is he watching every horse warm up stride for stride. No he can\'t. And if he is just watching certain Trainers and Connections that is a serious problem. Kenny runs them sound and Mystik Dan if that is the last race of his career should not be remembered as \"lame and unsound\" because a Hometown Vet said he was. Horse Racing is becoming unbettable.
Silver Charm Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> 6 straight wins in a Money Line parlay is
> significant. It wasnt 6 straight against the
> Raiders. You said it yourself.
>
> Always may have been an exaggeration. If its 60%
> of the time that\'s enough for a professional group
> like the one Billy Walters described in his Book.
> They played Coin Toss Selection tendencies. As in
> do they take the ball or defer. Amd who scores
> first. He claimed they had $50K maybe $100K on
> that Parlay in the Super Bowl with Arizona and
> Pittsburgh
>
> And NFL Official could call holding on every play.
> A Breeders Cup Vet is he watching every horse warm
> up stride for stride. No he can\'t. And if he is
> just watching certain Trainers and Connections
> that is a serious problem. Kenny runs them sound
> and Mystik Dan if that is the last race of his
> career should not be remembered as \"lame and
> unsound\" because a Hometown Vet said he was. Horse
> Racing is becoming unbettable.
You aren\'t playing a 6 game ML parlay because you haven\'t yet identified the streak. At what point do you say.....hey this team wins with this ref??
Unless you have an incredible ability to target a streak before it even happens.
Its an insignificant sample size, and you didn\'t target the streak from game 1 because you had no clue the next 5 games would also be wins....so not one person would have put together a 6 game ML parlay. Zero.
And my point using the Raiders is that if its so significant, why did they barely win as a 13 point fav?
Yes, there are very few officials that hover around 60%. And again, you have to identify them in time for it to matter...and guess what.....the following year they aren\'t close to 60%.
Your premise isn\'t bad, but putting it into practice isn\'t nearly as easy as you\'re making it out to be.